PIYW #3 — Meta Feedback

rsl12 · 2025-08-24T03:41:10+00:00

October 15, 2025 EDIT: "Play "Autumn Leaves" Your Way" is now live! You can continue to discuss your preparation of the piece here. The next PIYW will be ann...

diretonic

Simonb Thanks for the kind words Simon, these days I plan rather than play, so the walking bass + RH was a struggle for me too. I used to do a fair bit of it on some duo gigs but nothing remotely approaching the skill of the two Daves. (duos? Who could be so cheap? In my day, restaurants and the like could avoid the cost of a license by employing no more than two musicians.)

Re your B3, I wish my wife's old Challen sounded anywhere near as good but of course the sound needs to please the player - getting the new mic was a good move.

Simonb

Hi diretonic

I used to do some (very) amateur Jazz gigs in a duo, back in the 80s and 90s. I've never really made a serious attempt to play solo with a walking bass (except for blues/boogie), but coincidentally I picked up a 2nd hand Dave McKenna LP not that long ago, and with you mentioning him as well it seems to have set me off down that path. But it's a bit rocky!

Cheers

WieWaldi

Simonb I've never really made a serious attempt to play solo with a walking bass (except for blues/boogie)

May I ask you what walking bass line you played? (in blues/boogie)

I am asking, because there a so many variations out there, beginning from the kiddie version that has the LH on a static position, going up to a alternating octave tones with thumb and pinky, and then of course walk over multiple octaves going from the very left of the keyboard up to the mids.

Simonb

Hi WieWaldi

There's a number I use, some better than others, but the most common would be:

What is known as the chop, which isn't really a walking line, it's more of a one man rhythm section:
I.e. the first and second ones in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tHeB7c55hY

There are other variations on that one, that I play as well. One being a mix of the 3rd and 4th in that video.

The Jimmy Yancey LH pattern
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kg101gCiLEU

That maybe my favourite. It has a number of subtle variations. Most notably the way Prof Longhair used it.

The LH from Honky Tonk Train Blues.
Another that I mess around (pun!!) with is the walking octave style like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgkWICPCZ7M

And of course 4 can be simplified into a single note walking line rather than octaves.

Cheers

WieWaldi

Simonb Thank you.
Never heard the name "chop", I called it the shuffle so far. Or the humptee-dumptee LH 😆
The chop + inverse-chop, (alternating) is currently my to-go LH. The chop isn't that hard, but the inverse at the end of each bar still eats up a lot of my brain power.

About walking bass line, I tried to play the poor man's version. The little brother of 4. Cost me a lot of time to get it under my fingers: Link

rsl12

WieWaldi I feel like the kind of bass you are doing is harder than a standard walking bass. I think you could definitely create and perform an arrangement using walking bass, if you want, and it might be good for your left hand skills!

Improv over walking bass is another matter altogether. Very challenging!

diretonic

rsl12 Improv over walking bass is another matter altogether. Very challenging!

Too right!, but I think the approach should be much like that of blues LH patterns which are played on auto-pilot after enough practice. Most of my duo gigs were with vocalists so the job was mainly comping + walking bass. I knew most of the chords to the songs so the comping I could do on autopilot leaving me to focus on the walking and I found after a while that my patterns were all fairly formulaic so became almost automatic. The soloing (obligatory but short) was sometimes seat-of-the-pants stuff; a bit of walking, a bit of imaginary bass (as Simon mentions above), rinse, repeat.

WieWaldi

rsl12 Thanks for your encouraging words🤗
This is the reason why I call it the poor man's version: Christian taught it as the so much smaller brother of a bigger brother. He is right, playing the bigger brother is much harder. I can play it only if I am doing nothing else. And of course while I am looking at my hand, all the time.
And then I've spotted an even bigger brother of the bigger brother, walking the LH over two octaves. 🤯

rsl12

Now that Pachelbel Canon is "in the can", I can focus on this! So far all I've done is practice arpeggios and scales over a few LH styles. My observations:

obviously, scales are easy for this. C minor + a little C melodic minor are enough. I'm adding tritone subs, D locrian with raised 2nd, and G phrygian with raised 3rd to my practice.
because scales are easy, stretch voicings are also easy! I'm using this opportunity to practice octave+6th in the RH. I don't know if I will incorporate stretch voicings in my final recording, but it's fun to practice with them.
if you're going to learn walking bass, this is the tune to do it on! With descending quarter notes, you can just follow the scale down for practically forever. Going up, you just have to add one extra note every bar. Here's my recording demonstrating it.

My to do list:

Scales and arpeggios over rootless, walking bass, stride, octave+6th over rootless (stretch voicings)
listen to Wynton
listen to McKenna
come up with more drills after listening

WieWaldi

rsl12 ...C melodic minor are enough. I'm adding tritone subs, D locrian with raised 2nd, and G phrygian with raised 3rd...

I've heard all those terms, I am quite sure that I looked up the meaning in the past, and I am absolutely certain I've forgotten everything. 😅
Anyway, it sounds like you have a plan and I can't wait to hear the outcome.

rsl12

WieWaldi Anyway, it sounds like you have a plan and I can't wait to hear the outcome.

Most of my plan is to come up with a plan:

rsl12 come up with more drills after listening

keff Fortunately I had already submitted my recording before receiving the suggestion.

Fortunately or unfortunately? You can always re-upload your youtube video. No-one would know (not even me, since I haven't listened to any submissions yet).

Sophia

Oooh I do like that walking bass! There are some daring harmonies, but I think overall it works 😃

Mine is going to be the Harry Likas version. Nothing walks in that 🙂 I'm still at the "figuring out" stage, but I think it will be just my level. This forum is keeping us busy with recitals!

keff

I am playing Misty live this coming Saturday to my piano group and will start learning the Bill Evans version of Autumn Leaves after that, although I have already looked at the harmonies. I think Evans must have taken it at a fast tempo which is likely to be unachievable for me with about four weeks of practice but I think it will also work as a ballad.

keff

WieWaldi I am absolutely certain I've forgotten everything. 😅

Me too. I was revising both harmonic and melodic minor scales last week after a friend suggested I play part of Pachelbel's Canon in the minor. Fortunately I had already submitted my recording before receiving the suggestion.

Nightowl

WieWaldi I've heard all those terms, I am quite sure that I looked up the meaning in the past, and I am absolutely certain I've forgotten everything. 😅

Sounds like your memory is as good as mine - you can rely on it being totally unreliable. 🙃

@Sophia Same here, but walking base is not always a walk in the park for us BBs.

keff

rsl12 You can always re-upload your youtube video.

I have loaned the book containing the Canon to the friend who suggested playing it in the minor key. Admittedly I could get the book back on Saturday and then I might have no excuse.

rsl12

Another practice recording. Some Pachelbel Canon seeped through (though that comment might not make sense to anyone but Sophia). Still working on scales and arpeggios. Scattered, and I'm spread thin too much, trying too many styles. I'm going to start transcribing Wynton Kelly today and see where it takes me.

EDIT: Well, it seems someone has written out a transcription and put it on youtube! I find benefit in transcribing oneself, but I know Dave Mckenna will be much more challenging, so I will avail myself of the transcription.

ShiroKuro

rsl12 fun! Very nice!!

WieWaldi

rsl12 Another practice recording.

Very big mistake to listen to this. It's so discouraging when I am comparing it to my progress. 🤬 Ok, let's fire back: My version is longer than yours. It takes me a quarter of an hour to play through, not just two and a half minutes. 😂

Simonb

Hi rsl12

That's a good practise!

Cheers

Sophia

That sounds lovely rsl! That is definitely the type of swing I enjoy - and yes definitely noticed the Sooa Kim influence - how could I not after playing along with your part 3.197.973 times 🤣

rsl12

WieWaldi Very big mistake to listen to this. It's so discouraging when I am comparing it to my progress.

Oh no! That was the opposite of my intended purpose, which was to help us enjoy our shared journey. I would think everyone participating is improving through practice, but most of us have plenty of struggles left. And the practice recordings serve as evidence of both the improvement and the struggle.

I appreciate you mentioning speed, as I never practice as slow as I ought. You remind me that I need to get out the metronome.

ShiroKuro

WieWaldi It takes me a quarter of an hour to play through, not just two and a half minutes

Oh my gosh, I hear you on this!! I’m working on something that’s pretty far beyond the level of my usual pieces, and in order to play HT, I have to play sooooooo sloooooow…. 😅

rsl12 I never practice as slow as I ought.

This too. My new teacher is like “ok, play through that part once more but slowly,” and I play through it and she says, “ok, you’re getting another speeding ticket.” 😆

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